Remember windows 'JUST WORKS'

From: Rod 
------------------------------------------------------
So I need to update 8.1 to 8.1 update 1???
  Why not 8.1.1 or just 8.2?
Great give the xp crowd some sort justification.

Microsoft confirms it's dropping Windows 8.1 support
http://www.infoworld.com/t/microsoft-windows/microsoft-confirms-its-dropping-windows-81-support-240407
-- 
The unregulated free market is like Yog-Sothoth, a mythical being whose  
followers make bloody sacrifice to hasten its arrival to this world.

Using Opera's mail client: http://www.opera.com/mail/

=============================================================== From: Dave Brockman ------------------------------------------------------ -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 There is nothing special or new about this process, MS has always done this with the OS support. Two weeks ago, they did not support Windows XP, they supported Windows XP with SP3. Not SP2, not SP1 and not Virgin. Problems installing the service pack, well, there's absolutely nothing new with that either. To this day if you installing Windows 7 SP1 is still a "specific order of updates" nightmare for those of us who like to minimize the time it takes to patch a newly built system. Regards, dtb - -- "Some things in life can never be fully appreciated nor understood unless experienced firsthand. Some things in networking can never be fully understood by someone who neither builds commercial networking equipment nor runs an operational network." RFC 1925 -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.17 (MingW32) Comment: Using GnuPG with Thunderbird - http://www.enigmail.net/ iQEcBAEBAgAGBQJTTTp5AAoJEMP+wtEOVbcdtvAH/3r0Bvtp6bhI7ut6+OFpycr8 4VjJCtoD/helcrvJix01kRYbuHc/3TZ+RwdaswSxWbL25uIPgPoUC8mE9Nl6wqFU oNOFTI9kp0J7hheOmZGqmFg/rGfkA40zSPR/IQNKSqcO4b+1zN9HP2GVUSVQfeqn 3DXe3B3WQDe4zcny//TizVJir/aA8Sv5jdYgISXHHFKE6e/M1X5JvAy89pxRHgsM b/MNqWnK48CKXGroIHNswi8Jpa9jlSFUJxtqyfpherEHaEhx/GQ4p0Avs+Mh/ZEr J6mxTYXX72CQxZGx2KIAjV3pAfp1je75aezxWnDtyEwQ2Et/GZ6GgZWpIx90u6o= =S9o/ -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

=============================================================== From: Rod ------------------------------------------------------ You have to admit their naming conventions can be a bit unclear. On Tue, 15 Apr 2014 09:56:09 -0400, Dave Brockman wrote:

=============================================================== From: Chad Smith ------------------------------------------------------ All operating systems' naming conventions suck. (Sent from my Mac OS X 10.9.2 Mavericks computer, "X" as in "Ten" so "Mac Oh Ess Ten Ten point Nine point Two Mavericks") I miss big cats. *- Chad W. Smith*

=============================================================== From: Rod ------------------------------------------------------ At least they are using a version #. Windows went from version numbers, to dates, back to version numbers. With XP, Millenium, and Vista forming their own naming system in between. Add to that the ever confusing user levels which change with each version, Home, Premium, or Ultimate!

=============================================================== From: Chad Smith ------------------------------------------------------ Since we're on the griping about names subject (And I won't do more than just mention the garbage that is GIMP, BitchX, and any project that actually uses "GNU/Linux" in its title.) I hate version numbers. The reason - the "point". It should be a decimal point - but it's not. First sign is that there cannot be more than one decimal point - ever. But still my mind wants to make it one. Which really makes me confused and upset whenever they go over 9. 10.8.8 < 10.8.9 < 10.8.10 < 10.8.11 NOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!! REAL NUMBERS DO NOT WORK THAT WAY!!!! It would have been so much easier if they has used literally ANY OTHER PUNCTUATION MARK IN THE WORLD. 10-8-9 < 10-8-10 or 3:3:9 < 3:3:10 or 8!9!9 < 8!9!10 Whatever - just not the stinkin' dot. *- Chad W. Smith*

=============================================================== From: Stephen Kraus ------------------------------------------------------ They all have version numbers still, they are just hidden.

=============================================================== From: William Roush ------------------------------------------------------ If software versions automatically went from 1.0.9 to 1.1.0 my head would explode, I'm a huge follower of semantic versioning: http://semver.org/ William Roush william.roush@roushtech.net 423-463-0592 http://www.roushtech.net/blog/

=============================================================== From: Stephen Kraus ------------------------------------------------------ ....wait, what? It just make a sub-version change that is not major. Why is that wrong?

=============================================================== From: Benjamin Stewart ------------------------------------------------------ It gets better! Don't forget that "Windows 7" is actually Windows 6.1 and "Windows 8.1" is Windows 6.3!

=============================================================== From: DaWorm ------------------------------------------------------ On Tue, Apr 15, 2014 at 1:17 PM, William Roush wrote: 2. A normal version number MUST take the form X.Y.Z where X, Y, and Z are non-negative integers, and MUST NOT contain leading zeroes. X is the major version, Y is the minor version, and Z is the patch version. Each element MUST increase numerically. For instance: 1.9.0 -> 1.10.0 -> 1.11.0. Like Chad, 1.0.9 < 1.0.10 does not make sense to me. If it won't sort with a normal text sort, then it isn't readable by mere humans. All of my software releases have versions like 01.00.00.06. Platform.Major.Minor.Point (Platform is there because I have some code that is compiled from the same source for different hardware). Jeff.

=============================================================== From: DaWorm ------------------------------------------------------ Whereas 2.09 vs 2.10 is completely unambiguous. And if you have a need for something like 2.111 then I dare say you have a completely different type of problem. Jeff.

=============================================================== From: Chad Smith ------------------------------------------------------ Stephen, would you rather have 1.9 million dollars or 1.10 million dollars? or 2.9 decades to live or 2.10? if you have number "point" number #.# Then anyone with a 4th grade or higher understanding of math knows that .9 is bigger than .11 They even call it a "POINT" as in decimal "POINT". it's maddening. *- Chad W. Smith*

=============================================================== From: Chad Smith ------------------------------------------------------ yeah - that is pretty dumb. *- Chad W. Smith*

=============================================================== From: Ed King ------------------------------------------------------ I used to have double chin now I'm down to 1.5 chin=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A

=============================================================== From: Stephen Kraus ------------------------------------------------------ Except in those cases you are citing, those are linear numbers, 1.9 Million transitions to 2 million because that is how it works. You are talking about REVISION VERSIONS, they are not required for the digits to be linear, nor does an 11th sub revision suddenly turn into a major revision. The Decimal points do not function like they do in a normal decimal system: (Full Version).(Minor Version).(Sub Revisions) You are upset because you expect it to function like any other mathematics decimal system, but that isn't how it works.

=============================================================== From: Chad Smith ------------------------------------------------------ This. +1 I'm not saying it should be "forced" onto the next higher level (meaning every 10 bug fix releases = a minor release or even 10 minor releases = a major release) just a simple leading zero. or, again, use anything other than this "." *- Chad W. Smith*

=============================================================== From: Chad Smith ------------------------------------------------------ then use another annotation. MAJOR-Minor-sub MAJOR:Minor:sub MAJOR;Minor;sub MAJOR|Minor|sub MAJOR/Minor/sub MAJOR\Minor\sub MAJOR,Minor,sub there are literally dozens of other characters they could have used - any one of them a better choice than the ONE character that ALREADY has an established way of interacting with numbers that contradicts what they are now making it do. *- Chad W. Smith*

=============================================================== From: Eric Wolf ------------------------------------------------------ from distutils.version import StrictVersion a = StrictVersion("10.8.9") b = StrictVersion("10.8.10") if a < b: print "Version {} is less than version {}".format(a, b) if a > b: print "Version {} is greater than version {}".format(a, b) RESULTS: Version 10.8.9 is less than version 10.8.10. But yes... I love it when our project manager dumps my reports into Excel and it converts 6.1100 to 6.11. -Eric -=--=---=----=----=---=--=-=--=---=----=---=--=-=- Eric B. Wolf 720-334-7734

=============================================================== From: DaWorm ------------------------------------------------------ No, but the 100th sub version probably should cause an increment in the minor version. By the time you've done 99 sub revisions, what you have left is likely very different than what you began with. Likewise, 9999 sub versions is probably extremely different than the major version you started with. All it takes is one leading zero on the single digit version numbers, and much of the confusion goes away. 2.09 *always* comes before 2.10 that way. Not upset, but try running a directory listing on a folder full of different versions (assuming the version number is part of the file name). Nothing any sane person could do will make them sort in version number order when 2.9 is less than 2.10. Jeff,

=============================================================== From: Chad Smith ------------------------------------------------------ Yes telephone numbers use dashes - but in a telephone number 423-555-0009 is smaller than 423-555-0010. And also telephone numbers are not pure Numbers. I mean 555-1212 isn't an integer. It could be read as a formula, perhaps (resulting in -657) but you can't have 555-1222 of something. You can, however, have 10.9 of something - you can even have 10.10 of something, but it would be the same as having 10.1 of something. And if you have 10.11 of something you have less than if you had 10.9 of something= . The decimal point is a part of what makes a number a number. And it was absolutely the WORST POSSIBLE CHOICE for use in the way version numbers are written. It's just like electricity. It would have made so much more sense to say that electrons are positively charged. Formulas for centuries would have been so much more logical and less counterintuitive. There's no way to change it now. It's far too established. But that doesn't stop it from being retarded. (Reference: https://xkcd.com/567/ ) *- Chad W. Smith* for aracter, its just the chosen format. =80=99t of with numbers and =80=8E, =E2=80=8E2014 =E2=80=8E2=E2=80=8E:=E2=80=8E02=E2=80=8E =E2=80=8EPM rote: e

=============================================================== From: William Roush ------------------------------------------------------ Yeah my phone number results in "-632" this is absurd! Everyone change everything! My world is upside down because I can't apply basic mathematics to concepts that are not based in math! William Roush william.roush@roushtech.net 423-463-0592 http://www.roushtech.net/blog/

=============================================================== From: William Roush ------------------------------------------------------ Yeah I am really irked because how the hell am I having 3.5.95-RC2 of something?! This is /insanity/. William Roush william.roush@roushtech.net 423-463-0592 http://www.roushtech.net/blog/

=============================================================== From: Dave Brockman ------------------------------------------------------ -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 v1.0 v2.0 v3.0 v3.1 v3.11 v3.12 v95 v98 v98SecondEdition vMilleniumEdition v2000 vXP vVista v7 v8 v8.1 I can't imagine what you are referring to.... Regards, dtb - -- "Some things in life can never be fully appreciated nor understood unless experienced firsthand. Some things in networking can never be fully understood by someone who neither builds commercial networking equipment nor runs an operational network." RFC 1925 -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.17 (MingW32) Comment: Using GnuPG with Thunderbird - http://www.enigmail.net/ iQEcBAEBAgAGBQJTTZ1gAAoJEMP+wtEOVbcdsZYH/Rp2hz/CGyiSeWf9eowLzfhk x1J8Lv1gCD9BDmpzDvNSc2IKypHuH5UMDs0vcJA5cGx3hECXGmm6EWAw2dssVkr+ 6yTNNH0EyHaRFNcWhOimzC5eXCRYipfVNydyP/K6CGgs424UCZDZ/JPkgaYvMVjD FnTwxQQ/OqGw/+HFkyFIcksmy9DetuCfddun39NyaY7cdsqrc118YpM28pADHsWw H4gNJ6opft6eeJvgbkEtj4mQCJNn3L4i2nMN18VqdXzxzOalcgbXIrT3mR9/Lyl5 jXFWHfn0X12UqWhwdABHJfgNBqZzCXFzfrqco10tiyiDbFydWzXV3LWfQG7KkLc= =FicY -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

=============================================================== From: Dave Brockman ------------------------------------------------------ -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 It's a separator, it is not a decimal. While we're spouting our arseholes^W^W^W^W^W^W^W^W^W opinions, I prefer version numbers should only contain a major version and a build number, named for the date and/or time it was released. v1 build 20140415[1715]. Sorts like a champ and has meaning other than arbitrary, incrementing numbers separated by a period. And Chad, look, no period, minus or any other mathematical operator! Regards, dtb - -- "Some things in life can never be fully appreciated nor understood unless experienced firsthand. Some things in networking can never be fully understood by someone who neither builds commercial networking equipment nor runs an operational network." RFC 1925 -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.17 (MingW32) Comment: Using GnuPG with Thunderbird - http://www.enigmail.net/ iQEcBAEBAgAGBQJTTaJdAAoJEMP+wtEOVbcdZe8H/AniEVDawQkks1/IxlnHPkgg e1Tb5UVXJsqQ/Fbk1d18XnaNMR4iXIz5Oim4OzAzwmhP1qQA1YykSeuwSXFkQHm7 acmps7ub+q719UhoCu0zNSUAwa66lYbNp9+ysr0IkmZwvfsJVat0iJy+Dtrojhxw xfbWq/+XTHSO3i83YQikQPxyOZHaXpzBpsC1aO2idlw/5+X5dfoX3FUO3W2ohYo2 KKJDE5ZcMqIMSOOgOPorvg7wlakqpzMTtWhHrn1I/Gc6IJfGRONcNwJ+dO1Gbuwr FhySkvMDLBp/NTOyqneZrhxBwlizO3IUWWmckHiH7+mZlEEfGPVtixX005wzIgo= =u1qk -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

=============================================================== From: Stephen Kraus ------------------------------------------------------ As much as I enjoy math as a physics major, please stop applying it willy nilly to non-mathematical structures =80=8E =E2=80=8E15=E2=80=8E, =E2=80=8E2014 =E2=80=8E2=E2=80=8E:=E2=80=8E55= =E2=80=8E

=============================================================== From: Rod ------------------------------------------------------ unless your across the pond. In which case you wold have beef as they use periods like we use commas. ie 10.000 is ten thousand. Otherwise the fact that there are more than on "decimal" place should be a clue. -- The unregulated free market is like Yog-Sothoth, a mythical being whose followers make bloody sacrifice to hasten its arrival to this world. Using Opera's mail client: http://www.opera.com/mail/

=============================================================== From: Rod ------------------------------------------------------ looks like Windows 2000 was vers 7 to me. On Tue, 15 Apr 2014 13:26:44 -0400, Benjamin Stewart wrote:

=============================================================== From: Dave Brockman ------------------------------------------------------ -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 2000 was NT based. It was NT v5.0. Win3.x/9x were a different product line that died with ME at v4.90. All NT based are referenced as NT vX.X, non NT are referenced as vX.X. Only NT vX.X is valid since 2000. And we're only up to NT v6.3. Regards, dtb - -- "Some things in life can never be fully appreciated nor understood unless experienced firsthand. Some things in networking can never be fully understood by someone who neither builds commercial networking equipment nor runs an operational network." RFC 1925 -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.17 (MingW32) Comment: Using GnuPG with Thunderbird - http://www.enigmail.net/ iQEcBAEBAgAGBQJTTbdjAAoJEMP+wtEOVbcdQH0IAIdaF3EVdVeqKq1W8epXE5Gb IqiBuT8KjbtOhsh8ojkObKHzXMvp1YAOqDkVUTQ0SMHZwcGIbGpR7SFPYW3qoIBl ++ytfKNmaduTeAqBTPTWlMFy5R+L0dlMX0qo97+v6S/5cHu6c/vHwj2x7UfBSJQJ /tREKBoYcQE+Eb6R2VLuBwQEqZkqiQy55vpYKmyRX9KZDJOpOephNbQa0JyQdNSm noZnimh2HMleFZd2B9JbZz4qo7a8JW39NNKM1fc1JxRkd2wTuBJ+wKorUp83xCKK 77IJzafGJrIE0d4xRi1iB+KIMINsvu9TiheALfGibeXyOaU4MROX17G9LzyZrRQ= =bKUp -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

=============================================================== From: Chad Smith ------------------------------------------------------ i think Rod was counting this way, but it's just a guess: Windows 1.0 Windows 2.0 Windows 3.0 (3.1, 3.11, 3.12) Windows 95 (v4.0) Windows 98 (v5.0) 98 Second Edition (v5.1) Windows Millennium Edition (v6.0) Windows 2000 (v7.0) *- Chad W. Smith*

=============================================================== From: Chad Smith ------------------------------------------------------ Look, all I'm saying is - I don't like it. It's stupid to me. I understand what it means - and I know I have no power to change it - but it really sucks. It is also stupid that other countries use periods instead of comas. Grammatically that doesn't even make sense. As was pointed out, a period is a hard stop, and a coma is a pause. You don't hard-stop after every 10^3 spaces. You do hard stop when you get to the end of the whole numbers. Or at least it is a "harder" stop than between the Thousands and Hundreds place. Regardless - I will never like it, and I find it to be more annoying than Windows 8.1 update 1. Quite frankly - I like the Google Chrome / Firefox approach. Automatic updates and the version numbers are pretty much out of view unless you really want to find it. -Chad

=============================================================== From: Stephen Kraus ------------------------------------------------------ As most of those other countries invented most of the maths we used today, I suspect we are the ones in error Chad.