Understanding servers and networking

From: Garrett Gaston 
------------------------------------------------------


I would really like to learn a lot about servers=2C databases=2C and networ=
king. When I read about just one of these subjects I am always being refere=
nced specific and what to me is complex information about the other two. I =
know that apache is server software=2C though if it's running on my compute=
r I wouldn't know it or how to experiment with it. I know that SQL is a dat=
abase language and when I a buy book to practice with=2C it directs me to d=
ownload MySQL=2C which I believe is also server software that somehow has S=
QL already build in. While reading on SQL/MySQL I am told to research apach=
e. But if apache is server software=2C as supposedly is MySQL=2C then it ap=
pears to me I'M being asked to run server software (apache) so that I can r=
un server software (MySQL). I can't make any sense of all this. From what I=
 can tell=2C you have to be an expert just to get started. These subjects (=
servers=2C databases=2C networking) are subjects that I love and would real=
ly like to learn (along with Linux of course) but am having a most difficul=
t time getting started. Should I start with a server with my Linux desktop =
or would it be more simple to start and learn with Windows. I thought maybe=
 I could start with a Windows media server for my iTunes library. In that c=
ase what would I need=2C just a simple copy of Microsoft Windows Server 200=
8? Would a book on Server 2008 be useful at all or would it again assume ab=
undant knowledge of said topics? 		 	   		  =

=============================================================== From: Ryan Macy ------------------------------------------------------ You typically use a sql server (mysql, postgresql, mssql, oracle) with a webserver though that doesn't have to be the case. SQL is just a language designed to interact with relational databases, it has various clauses and statements that help you manage data. The main idea behind relational databases is basically to give you a place to store data in a relational way and to link that data together using keys, this helps ensure data consistency. Relational databases conform to ACID. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ACID A database engine or database (postgresql mysql etc etc) it just the driving force that stores, handles, and modifies your data, and they all have various dialects. T-SQL or transact SQL is what access and mssql use, this is microsofts spin on SQL. Oracle uses PSQL, mysql and postregsql use a blander version of SQL with their own caveats. mysql and oracle are going to be somewhat similar in design as they are owned by the same company. There are various webservers you can use to host and handle your webpages. Light and nimble servers are nginx and lighttpd. These are slightly more complicated and advance in their management but preform better with certain types of websites than say apache. Apache is a very simple but extensive webserver that is often used in the web today. It is robust and has many addons or modules that extend its capabilities. Essentially a webserver handles client requests for data and then servers that data up. Sometimes it will use server side languages like python, php, and ruby to create more of an application/dynamic website that handles very complicated requests over a static website that displays general html markup. Microsoft also has a server product, it's called IIS, and I dont really recommend playing with it. Apache can be run on windows server and the process to getting it installed is rather simple, in fact there are premade hosting stacks you can install. One such common stack is called WAMP or windows apache mysql php. You can find that here http://www.wampserver.com/en/

=============================================================== From: Randy Yates ------------------------------------------------------ If you want to learn the Linux side of things, you can usually install MySQL and Apache pretty easily on most distributions. Apache is a web server for serving up HTTP requests. MySQL is a database server. Web pages which have dynamic information usually need a database from which to pull said information. Some of the most popular database management systems are MySQL, PostgreSQL, Oracle, and MSSQL. If you plan to store data of some kind, you'll probably need a database. Depending on your Linux distribution, I can help you get started with both Apache and MySQL. If you want to try the Windows side, you have a couple of options. You can install IIS which is the Windows web server, or you can install xampp, which is a complete Apache, PHP, and MySQL package for Windows.

=============================================================== From: James Nylen ------------------------------------------------------ Apache is a "web server" in that if Apache is running, your computer will accept connections on port 80 and send back webpages. Something similar is happening on the computer you reach whenever you go to a website using http://somesite.com. MySQL is a "database server". It is NOT a web server (it does not serve webpages). Instead, it listens on a different port (3306 by default) and accepts SQL queries that return results from its stored databases or manipulate the data there. Both are "server software" in the sense that they listen on a port, accept connections on that port, and communicate via those connections. However this is a misleading term and is probably the source of some of your confusion. To build web applications you write code that a webserver such as Apache executes, like PHP scripts. If these applications are complex enough, then they will probably need to store their data in a database, which is where database servers like MySQL come in. I would start with just Apache and learn how to serve a very simple website using only static HTML pages.

=============================================================== From: Ryan Macy ------------------------------------------------------ If you're truly wanting to just learn about servers I would do a LAMP stack on linux. PHP has a large amount of community help on the internet available as well as MySQL. If you're looking to learn more about programming and databases I would suggest, python and SQLite. Python is an excellent programming language and SQLite is exactly what the name applies, a very simple lightweight data storing application based off of SQL.

=============================================================== From: Billy ------------------------------------------------------ A server isn't a software package. It's how you use it. A building could be a job or a home -- depending on how you use it. Word is software. Internet Explorer is software. Apache is software. Java is= software. MySql is software. That's it. Each software has a function. Some do lots of functions. Others do just one f= unction (the "date" command tells you the date). Now, some documentation may describe apache and mysql as "server software", b= ut that's just a label on what environment people typically deploy such soft= ware. It's like buying a "work truck". Just because you purchase a truck that is c= onsidered a "work vehicle" doesn't mean you magically own a business now. Apache is software that delivers content to web browsers. A computer who's s= ole function is to deliver web pages to web browsers is -- a web server. You= r desktop that happens to have apache running on it is -- still just your de= sktop. Mysql is software that stores information and provides a way to retrieve the= information and store new information. Call it database software. It happen= s to use SQL as a language to retrieve and store information. Thus it is SQL= database software. A computer running mysql who's function is to store and p= rovide data to other software or computers (people) is called -- a databae s= erver. Your desktop running mysql is still -- just your desktop. Sent from my iPhone=

=============================================================== From: Aaron Welch ------------------------------------------------------ You are going in the wrong direction in both effort and cost. Win2008 Serve= r is around $500 and you will still have to set up all the "server" software= such as MySQL and Apache. Look into what is commonly referred to as the LA= MP stack under Linux. Use your ubuntu install to get a handle for what each= does. It sounds to me like you really need to get familiar with common Lin= ux/server technology terms as you are really shooting in the dark right now.= =20 The great thing about this list is that we will answer just about any questi= on posted. The one thing that we will not do is actually do the work for yo= u. I strongly suggest that you immerse yourself in reading everything you c= an on networking and basic Linux commands. Work through a how-to or 10 to g= et a good knowledge base. I am sure that you are capable of seeking the answers on your own, but lack t= he general points of reference to be able to structure questions that have c= lear answers. Questions like "How do I configure networking between windows= and Linux?" are answered in detail at the Ubuntu website and all over Googl= e. I am not meaning to come off harsh, just trying to set some realistic expect= ations for you. -AW g. When I read about just one of these subjects I am always being referenced= specific and what to me is complex information about the other two. I know t= hat apache is server software, though if it's running on my computer I would= n't know it or how to experiment with it. I know that SQL is a database lang= uage and when I a buy book to practice with, it directs me to download MySQL= , which I believe is also server software that somehow has SQL already build= in. While reading on SQL/MySQL I am told to research apache. But if apache i= s server software, as supposedly is MySQL, then it appears to me I'M being a= sked to run server software (apache) so that I can run server software (MySQ= L). I can't make any sense of all this. =46rom what I can tell, you have to b= e an expert just to get started. These subjects (servers, databases, network= ing) are subjects that I love and would really like to learn (along with Lin= ux of course) but am having a most difficult time getting started. Should I s= tart with a server with my Linux desktop or would it be more simple to start= and learn with Windows. I thought maybe I could start with a Windows media s= erver for my iTunes library. In that case what would I need, just a simple c= opy of Microsoft Windows Server 2008? Would a book on Server 2008 be useful a= t all or would it again assume abundant knowledge of said topics?

=============================================================== From: James Nylen ------------------------------------------------------ What do you mean by this? What would such a server do? In that case what would I need, just a simple copy of Microsoft Windows Windows Server 2008 does not have a media server built in, as far as I know. Would a book on Server 2008 be useful at all or would it again assume You should either pick Windows or Linux to start with. Either one will assume prior knowledge of networking. For that, you need to google things like "basics of networking" or "basics of how the Internet works".

=============================================================== From: Dave Brockman ------------------------------------------------------ Hi Garrett, I don't think we've actually introduced yet. My suggestion to you (and any others with similar desires) is to begin with basic (TCP/IP) networking. Everything else will build from that. Let me also provide a couple of definitions for you. In Networking, a "server" is a piece of software that listens for incoming requests from "clients" to service. Apache is an HTTP (or "web") "server". It listens for requests from clients (browsers) to serve web pages. The beauty of the original design and thought processes is that *any* machine on the network can be a "server", it just needs to run the software. MySQL is a SQL database "server". SQL is the language you use to talk to MySQL when you ask it questions about the data in your database, or ask it to add records, or update information. My suggestion is that you find a spare PC, or use a VM, and pick a purpose (web server, sql server, host your own copy of nagios/cacti, something). Once you get a little more wet on the networking side, we'll start talking about setting up a proper router for whatever you've got going on for a network there :) Regards, dtb

=============================================================== From: Dave Brockman ------------------------------------------------------ That won't really teach him much about servers.... Regards, dtb

=============================================================== From: Stephen Kraus ------------------------------------------------------ Hi my name is Stephen and i'll be your server today...

=============================================================== From: James Nylen ------------------------------------------------------ GET / HTTP/1.1

=============================================================== From: Dave Brockman ------------------------------------------------------ It does unfortunately[1].... I'd actually recommend starting with a *nix based OS to begin your networking journey. It will give you great enlightenment (and frustration) as you begin this journey on the dark side. Regards, dtb [1] - http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/windowsserver/dd448620.aspx

=============================================================== From: James Nylen ------------------------------------------------------ Ugh

=============================================================== From: Dave Brockman ------------------------------------------------------ LOL, that pretty much sums up my thoughts on it too ;) Regards, dtb

=============================================================== From: Ryan Macy ------------------------------------------------------ It was a additional comment to my first email, but I think trying to setup Apache on a linux box forces you to go seek information that will eventually bring about an understanding of how a server works and the various things that it can do. You have to start somewhere, and configuring (for me) generally helps to get a understanding of the process.

=============================================================== From: Randy Yates ------------------------------------------------------ I thought I remembered 2008 having some streaming media server.

=============================================================== From: Dave Brockman ------------------------------------------------------ Been there since Server 2000, used to be an add-on for NT40... NetShow or something like that... Regards, dtb

=============================================================== From: Stephen Kraus ------------------------------------------------------ It does, as well as a virtual client server works". frustration)

=============================================================== From: Lynn Dixon ------------------------------------------------------ Im pretty sure 2008 has a media streamer in one of its "roles". I have seen it alot in both 2008 and 2008 R2.

=============================================================== From: Randy Yates ------------------------------------------------------ Dave answered it earlier. We were late to the party, Lynn.

=============================================================== From: Lynn Dixon ------------------------------------------------------ LOLS. I tend to read the LUG alot less frequently recently.

=============================================================== From: Dave Brockman ------------------------------------------------------ Most distros have a LAMP or "www|database" options with pre-configured defaults that will get it up and running just by installing the packages. Sorry, didn't mean to sound snippy :) Regards, dtb

=============================================================== From: Dave Brockman ------------------------------------------------------ http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windows

=============================================================== From: Dave Brockman ------------------------------------------------------

=============================================================== From: Ryan Macy ------------------------------------------------------ I can confirm it is a role, I work at a windows server shop

=============================================================== From: Dave Brockman ------------------------------------------------------ (lots of us on here manage windows boxen, some better than others :)) I got happy when I remembered NetShow correctly and fired off my email before fully reading the fine article :) Regards, dtb

=============================================================== From: Dave Brockman ------------------------------------------------------ -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 IIS and WAMP run on Windows. Server and Workstation is a distinction created by MS originally via few registry entries. The differences: WS allowed 10 connections, Server allowed more. WS allowed foreground applications to take priority, Server did not You can install a WAMP stack on 7 or XP, or you can shell cash and get 2008 if it floats your boat, but this is a "Unix" list, so we're not really apt to spend a lot of time discussing MS server OS (outside of whatever John needs this week :)) Regards, dtb -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.17 (MingW32) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iEYEARECAAYFAk6HyPgACgkQABP1RO+tr2SkmgCcDXIOf0fqIHvGmUb29yxpQUGq DkcAoKXv4CEpbFECsL6x/A7Sn1qKSo+f =NDiW -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

=============================================================== From: Dave Brockman ------------------------------------------------------ -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Depends. You can host files to be downloaded via HTTP (apache) or FTP (proftpd/vsftpd/ncftpd) or CIFS (samba) or SVN (or WebDAV) (subversion or apache+WebDav) Regards, dtb -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.17 (MingW32) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iEYEARECAAYFAk6HyekACgkQABP1RO+tr2TxXgCeL0Y0oOaSgumh7wyGp5UZUxPA e8QAn2qtFFCG/19mxOxibjzvdXqTqkMh =10CE -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

=============================================================== From: Dave Brockman ------------------------------------------------------ -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Installing Server 2008 (aside from Web Edition) does not install a web server by default. You still have to either install IIS or apache. It also does not install a SQL database server by default, so you must install MS-SQL-Express, or MySQL, or . Out of the box, about all you get are admin shares, you have to configure every aspect of "server" software, be it CIFS file shares, NTP time serving, authorization/directory services, etc.... Regards, dtb -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.17 (MingW32) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iEYEARECAAYFAk6Hy2IACgkQABP1RO+tr2TStACfaDJdR/y6hNdQPZ+yS5vFe0js KKAAoKrvWuiERyZSrdK9LrzZ3WOVXPCM =a1Um -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

=============================================================== From: Billy ------------------------------------------------------ I think you need to rise above the forest a little bit in order to see the t= rees. Just think of software as software. Dont apply too much importance to the "s= erver" label. A vendor may ascribe special specifications to something calle= d "server", just like a vendor ascribes meaning to "commercial grade" or "mi= litary grade". Commercial grade materials. Military grade encryption. Server grade harddriv= e. Yet, you're not at the point in your knowledge to really appreciate or act u= pon the nuances of what these terms mean. And honestly, if you put too much m= eaning behind these terms, then you're just going to get lost in the details= . My advise: ignore the "server" term. Mentally replace that word with "Platin= um" or whatever. Windows 2008 PLATINUM edition! Apache PLATINUM software! It's just a label (for now). How do computers work? How does the Internet work? Research that. Learn the generalized terms. Don't pidgin hole yourself into l= earning about one specific implementation: ex how do DELL computers work. Ju= st get some general knowledge. Ram, CPU, hard drive, network card, video, keyboard, mouse - commonly called= a computer if put together correctly. How do they work together? You will need this knowledge if you want to progress in your knowledge of Li= nux (and windows) administration. If you're just looking for a cheap way to s= tore your music files, and you don't care about learning anything else. -- s= top reading and google "cheap network attached storage". Then buy that. If you're wanting to learn, then continue reading. Research how a computer works. Research how a network works (or at least the= Internet). Apache in it's basic form: * accepts requests from web browsers * processes the request * delivers a response to the request That's it. Requests can be: * a request for a file (aboutus.html) * a request for a script (cart.php) * a request for something else (action.do) Apache may process the request itself, it may hand off the request to a plug= in-module, it may proxy it to another computer, it may do a hybrid of all th= ree. What you see in your web browser is irrelevant to apache. Apache doesn't car= e. It's just doing what it's told, and that is contained in the page in your= browser. The page you are viewing may have links -- those links are just mo= re requests for more files or scripts. Apache doesn't care. Apache takes requests and delivers responses. Now scripts: scripts are another type of software. That's RIGHT! Apache is s= oftware that can run other software! It's similar to: Linux or windows are j= ust software that run other software. Everything is in layers. Layers and la= yers of software running other software. So scripts are software. When apache hands off a request to a script, the sc= ript now processes the req on apache's behalf. The script might need to: che= ck inventory, charge a credit card, update a database, send out an email and= craft a response. When the script is done, it hands the response back to ap= ache. Apache then delivers it to your web browser which has been waiting wit= h baited breath the whole time. This all happens in microseconds. Notice above I mentioned that a script might update a database? Yeah... That= 's just more software. It will talk to another piece of software: database s= oftware. Database software takes a request, processes the request and delivers a resp= onse. Sounds similar? It is. Except a web request is different from a databa= se request. Web request: I want to purchase a red bag. Database request: update the database to show that someone bought a red bag.= This database software may reside on the same machine as the apache software= . It may. But it doesn't need to. In fact from apache and the script's persp= ective -- it really doesn't matter -- whatever -- it's all the same to apach= e and the script. Mysql is database software. There are lots of database software. Some are fr= ee. Some are cheap. Some are expensive. Expensive does not always mean bette= r. In lots of cases expensive just means it costs more money. Any software that takes a request, processes it and delivers a response is c= alled: client-server software. It's just a label to describe behavior. Client: request creator Server: response deliverer So we could call client-server software by a different name: request-respons= e software. It's just a label. Sent from my iPhone e like apache, how would this work if that same webpage had links to files? W= ould the same machine be running another piece of server software apart from= apache but at the same time that was made for file serving?

=============================================================== From: Tim Youngblood ------------------------------------------------------ Server is a term that should be defined. To a software guy like me, a server is anything that accepts a request over a network and returns a result. I can write that in about 1 minute in a variety of languages. There are typically numerous servers running on a useful machine at any point. I can, and do, run a number of services on my local machine among them Tomcat (port 8080) and sometimes LAMP stack. Microsoft would like you to believe a 'server' is something you have to pay dearly begotten treasure $$$ to obtain which is far from true. You are on the correct list to be discovering interesting things about serving data. Linux is cheaper and faster, especially when it comes to learning the ropes. You don't need a quad server with 96GB of ram to run Linux and learn the fundamentals of server computing. These fundamentals will give you an edge over others in the marketplace and in the day to day. And the community support is ubiquitous. See the previous post by flushy which was written on his iPhone. I rest my case! Welcome.

=============================================================== From: Michael Scholten ------------------------------------------------------ Just playing with a thought... You (Garrett - browser/client) requested information from the Chugalug email list (server). This "server" passed the "request" onto a "database" (the various list members) which then passed back a response crafted from the "parameters" you/the-client-software gave it. In this case, "I would really like to learn a lot about servers, databases, and networking...". In this case the "server" (the chugalug email address chugalug@chugalug.org) has been told to hand off any requests to a list of "databases" (our email addresses) These "databases" take the request and act upon it. In this case, "we need to respond with data/information about servers, mysql, apache, etc". We go "I know something about servers/whatever..." and send a response back to the "server" (chugalug@chugalug.org) which copies the response/email sends one to you/the-client and has also been configured to send a copy out to everyone else except the original sender. (you didn't want to get your email copied back to you anyways did you?) You could then say that we (as databases) will then act on the various responses sent in by everyone else as we want/are configured to do. I am interested in (that is to say, configured to save data given to me about servers, apache, sql, etc) and thus will add-to-my-database/remember (or in my case attempt to remember...) the information I read/receive. Again, playing with a thought... ;) But since I know very little about servers/database/etc... this could all be wrong... Hope I understood a little though. -Michael

=============================================================== From: Billy ------------------------------------------------------ I believe that is a fair analogy. We are all a part of one massively scaled, parallel application that adheres= to the client-server paradigm. (request-response). vers/database/etc... this could all be wrong... Hope I understood a little t= hough.

=============================================================== From: Dan Lyke ------------------------------------------------------ On Sat, 1 Oct 2011 21:11:19 -0500 Garrett Gaston wrote: Let's get really concrete here. If that HTML file has a link that looks like: another file Then when your browser goes to request it, it will use whatever protocol and path your first file was loaded with. So if you were viewing that with http://www.flutterby.net/yourfile.html,">http://www.flutterby.net/yourfile.html, your browser would prepend http://www.flutterby.net/ to the request before it went looking for it. If, on the other hand, you were browsing that with file:///user/danlyke/websites/flutterby.net/public

=============================================================== From: Michael Scholten ------------------------------------------------------ Hate to say it but I got a "400 Bad Request" telnet www.flutterby.net 80 -Michael

=============================================================== From: Billy ------------------------------------------------------ I disagree (for this specific case). Shared glossary terms are helpful for group communications and collaboration= . Yet, some people may get hung up on the details of the terms and miss the co= re concepts. Some people can use the terms as a platform to build more under= standing. It really boils down to the learning style. I mentioned to Garret that he should ignore the server term (for now), as I f= elt he was struggling with the conflicting terms for the word "server" in so= far as it applies to a software dev guy, to a hardware guy, and to a Micros= oft sales rep. That term means different things to each. Thus, my advice: ignore it for now. Once he learns the core concepts, come b= ack and pick up the term. He will have a better appreciation for the differe= nt glossary terms for the word "server". The knowledge of the term means not= hing if you don't know when to apply it. In the end, a glossary term won't help his knowledge if he's already battlin= g the conflicting definitions. Koen: An aspiring student approaches a zen master wishing to learn from him.= The student tells the master of all the aspects of zen he has heard about a= nd all the things he wants to learn more about. The zen master patiently lis= tens and begins to poor tea into the student's cup. The tea soon overflows a= nd the student exclaims, "the cup is already too full!" The master nods and s= ays, "so too is your mind, and like the cup it can not hold any more knowled= ge unless it is empty." Thus, ignore the word "server". --b

=============================================================== From: Dan Lyke ------------------------------------------------------ On Sun, 2 Oct 2011 11:46:20 -0400 Michael Scholten wrote: Whoops. Sorry, reflex: After you type in GET / HTTP/1.1 Host: www.flutterby.net Hit enter *twice*. My bad.

=============================================================== From: Michael Scholten ------------------------------------------------------ It worked! -Michael

=============================================================== From: Dan Lyke ------------------------------------------------------ On Sun, 2 Oct 2011 12:43:15 -0400 Michael Scholten wrote: So, other things to try: You can use "HEAD" rather than "GET" to see the headers. It'd take a bunch more work to get right, but you can also do a "POST" (ie: send stuff to the server, as you'd do when you press the submit button on a web page form) like this. And you can put other things in there after the "GET" other than "/", like GET /Categories HTTP/1.1 Host: www.flutterby.net And voila, you're half-way to writing your first web browser (ie: client, in the client-server scheme of things). Dan

=============================================================== From: Aaron Welch ------------------------------------------------------ This is a "primarily" Linux list. I have worked (or still work) for M$ on t= heir backup products as a consultant. I would not direct a noob to Windows s= erver products because they tend to obscure critical configuration options f= rom the user. Linux forces you to know WHY something works, not just point a= nd pray that it does. -AW oft Server 2008? All I'M hearing anything about is IIS and wamp. Please reme= mber I don't really know anything about servers so I have a lot of confusion= and thus a lot of questions. QL and Apache pretty easily on most distributions.=20 erver. Web pages which have dynamic information usually need a database from= which to pull said information. Some of the most popular database managemen= t systems are MySQL, PostgreSQL, Oracle, and MSSQL. If you plan to store dat= a of some kind, you'll probably need a database.=20 Apache and MySQL.=20 install IIS which is the Windows web server, or you can install xampp, whic= h is a complete Apache, PHP, and MySQL package for Windows. te: g. When I read about just one of these subjects I am always being referenced= specific and what to me is complex information about the other two. I know t= hat apache is server software, though if it's running on my computer I would= n't know it or how to experiment with it. I know that SQL is a database lang= uage and when I a buy book to practice with, it directs me to download MySQL= , which I believe is also server software that somehow has SQL already build= in. While reading on SQL/MySQL I am told to research apache. But if apache i= s server software, as supposedly is MySQL, then it appears to me I'M being a= sked to run server software (apache) so that I can run server software (MySQ= L). I can't make any sense of all this. =46rom what I can tell, you have to b= e an expert just to get started. These subjects (servers, databases, network= ing) are subjects that I love and would really like to learn (along with Lin= ux of course) but am having a most difficult time getting started. Should I s= tart with a server with my Linux desktop or would it be more simple to start= and learn with Windows. I thought maybe I could start with a Windows media s= erver for my iTunes library. In that case what would I need, just a simple c= opy of Microsoft Windows Server 2008? Would a book on Server 2008 be useful a= t all or would it again assume abundant knowledge of said topics?

=============================================================== From: Ryan Macy ------------------------------------------------------ hehehe

=============================================================== From: Dan Lyke ------------------------------------------------------ On Sun, 2 Oct 2011 17:52:10 -0500 Garrett Gaston wrote: Aha! There are a bunch of ways to do this, but here's a place to start: First off, install the OpenSSH server on your Fedora desktop. I think in Debian/Ubuntu that's the openssh-server package. Second, figure out the IP address of your Fedora desktop machine. In a pinch, you can go to a command-line and type in "ifconfig eth0" and the address will pop up there, probably something like 192.168.1.4. For this next step, I'll assume that your user name on both machines is identical, and for example purposes we'll use "garrett". Go to your Ubuntu laptop, open a shell session and type "ssh 192.168.1.4" (for example). It will ask you for your password. Type in the password of your Fedora desktop. You now have a shell session on your Fedora machine. Great, you say, but what I really wanted to do was copy a file! Humor me for a moment, first. Type: "mkdir ~/.ssh; chmod 0700 ~/.ssh". Don't worry about the details for now, we'll get there later. Here's where it gets fun: Type "exit" to close out the shell session on your Fedora machine and return to the shell on your Ubuntu laptop. scp filename.source garrett@192.168.1.4:filename.dest This invokes "secure copy", which copies filename.source to the remote machine's username account as filename.dest. However, it asks you for your password. This sucks. Here's where it gets fun. On your Ubuntu laptop, type "ssh-keygen" and hit enter for all of the defaults (I mean, you can choose other stuff, but we're just playing on a local network for now). This creates two files in your ~/.ssh directory. They can be called one of two things, either "id

=============================================================== From: Billy ------------------------------------------------------ Ah! First to get the right answer, you must ask the right question. How do I transfer files from one computer over to another? The answer is: it depends on your situation. Can both computers surf the Internet? If the answer is yes, then you are half way there. Step 1. Have a network. Step 2. Requestor-responder (client-server) One computer will act as a client (requestor), the other will act as the ser= ver (responder). Request: I wish to send files to you, and have you store them for me. Here a= re the files. Response: success or failure. The request can take two forms: scp or rsync. scp is a ssh wrapper around "cp". It literally means SecureCoPy (note the ca= pital letters). Rsync is program (self contained software) that allows you to Remotely SYNCr= onize a directory (or set of files) with another computer. (note the capital= s). Rsync CAN use ssh to perform the network connection. (most people use th= at form of rsync). I suggest using scp for one or two files. For LARGE files or many files inside sub-directories, I suggest rsync. Rsync= has options to "start where I left off if I was interrupted" and "only tran= sfer the parts of the large file that are different." If you are using konquor (kde) or gnome, you may be able to use their naviga= tor to help with this. I suggest google to point you in a better direction. I= , myself, use the command line as it always works, irregardless of my enviro= nment or how I'm connected. Command line in this case, refers to the scp or r= sync command. Step 1. Have a network. If both computers can not surf the web at the same time, then you have some w= ork to do. A network is more than just two wires and a switch connecting two computers.= But, before we complicate matters, let's just see if you can get both to su= rf at the same time. --b

=============================================================== From: Average SecurityGuy ------------------------------------------------------ Buy a new USB NIC that does work with Linux. This one does: http://amzn.to/rmamLa

=============================================================== From: Billy ------------------------------------------------------ Objection 1: One of the computers has a network device that is not supported in Linux (as far as you know). Possible Solution to 1: Temporarily hook up the offending computer to a wired network and then surf the internet. Possible Solution to 1: Purchase another wireless adapter that is known to work. Possible Solution to 1: Research ways to connect USB adapter through Linux, copy needed drives via a usb stick to complete task of driver selection for Linux. --b